Author Topic: Really annoying- Lending Robot suspending Folio buying/selling  (Read 1130 times)

dr.everett

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Received the following email from Lending Robot today- really annoyed  >:(
__

We are temporarily suspending our secondary market automated trading feature, as we have noticed issues with performance. This causes some slowdown on our servers, which are not really justified because the trading volume is still very low. Any sales currently listed will run until the last remaining days of active sales. Recurring sales will not be set to recur as we disable the secondary market trading feature.

Naturally, you can still trade on the Lending Club's secondary market manually, by visiting the Lending Club site.

We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause you. We understand it can be frustrating, but also believe it will ultimately help us serve you better.

Regards,
The LendingRobotTeam
__

Hoping they fix this fast.

fliphusker

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Re: Really annoying- Lending Robot suspending Folio buying/selling
« Reply #1 on: July 12, 2017, 08:15:08 AM »
So they are seeing this as an issue with FOLIO bogging down their servers?
LR does not let you handpick notes if I remember right? I think that is why I never used them.
That sucks though with the volume that you deal with. I am sure you will not use NSR as believe you can only hand pick. PeerCube?


dr.everett

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Re: Really annoying- Lending Robot suspending Folio buying/selling
« Reply #2 on: July 12, 2017, 09:42:22 PM »
Not sure exactly how they see this- if it's on their side or on Folio- I plan to email them later tonight and ask some pointed questions.

Bigger issue I have right now is my plans to liquidate- it was going reasonably well. Now it's going to become a lot more manual, and worse off- I was selling notes at somewhat of a markup via LR. Now that won't happen.

I think depending on their answers I may hold off on the liquidation efforts. If they say that they'll have it fixed shortly- I can wait. If they don't have an answer.... >:(

I'm already seeing the effect in my IRA account- it's got $2k in cash right now not going anywhere and will build up quickly. My new note criteria is extremely tight given the recent quality issues, and the building cash balance reflects that. My plan was to keep my IRA investing to minimize the losses until I liquidated my taxable account so I could apply the lessons learned to liquidate it as quickly and efficiently as possible.

If the balance gets too big I may have to manually purchase from Folio.  ::)

toben88

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Re: Really annoying- Lending Robot suspending Folio buying/selling
« Reply #3 on: July 13, 2017, 11:28:24 AM »
The LR folio tools are the main reason I use LR.

Please communicate your plans to fix this so I do not need to leave the platform.

.Ryan.

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Re: Really annoying- Lending Robot suspending Folio buying/selling
« Reply #4 on: July 13, 2017, 03:46:49 PM »
The LR folio tools are the main reason I use LR.

Please communicate your plans to fix this so I do not need to leave the platform.

I'm in the same boat. All I invest in is the secondary market. Without SM support, I'm not sure why I should keep my LR account.

dr.everett

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Re: Really annoying- Lending Robot suspending Folio buying/selling
« Reply #5 on: July 13, 2017, 09:25:54 PM »
I emailed them yesterday and have not received a reply yet. I would encourage everyone to ask them the same questions I did.

1.  Is this temporary?
2. If so, when will it be fixed?
3. Since they are a paid service, what credit will you get since all services are not being provided?


Emmanuel

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Re: Really annoying- Lending Robot suspending Folio buying/selling
« Reply #6 on: July 14, 2017, 02:00:13 PM »
I understand that the suspension of trading on LC's secondary market can be frustrating.
Please be assured that we spent literally months developing this, and the decision to suspend it wasn't taken lightly.

Unfortunately, at this stage, even constantly re-submitting orders with tens of servers, the service still did not perform as we'd like.
Hopefully in the future submitting orders will be cheaper/faster/more efficient and we'll be able to resume this feature, but we can't commit on a date for the moment being.

As a reminder, LendingRobot never charged anything for selling LC notes.

apc3161

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Re: Really annoying- Lending Robot suspending Folio buying/selling
« Reply #7 on: July 14, 2017, 04:37:25 PM »
I understand that the suspension of trading on LC's secondary market can be frustrating.
Please be assured that we spent literally months developing this, and the decision to suspend it wasn't taken lightly.

Unfortunately, at this stage, even constantly re-submitting orders with tens of servers, the service still did not perform as we'd like.
Hopefully in the future submitting orders will be cheaper/faster/more efficient and we'll be able to resume this feature, but we can't commit on a date for the moment being.

As a reminder, LendingRobot never charged anything for selling LC notes.

I might just be 1 anecdote, but the entire reason I use LR is for the secondary market access. I stopped investing in primary notes and I suppose now will just withdraw all cash as it comes in. I hope you are able to resolve these issues quickly.

dr.everett

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Re: Really annoying- Lending Robot suspending Folio buying/selling
« Reply #8 on: July 14, 2017, 05:48:39 PM »
I understand that the suspension of trading on LC's secondary market can be frustrating.
Please be assured that we spent literally months developing this, and the decision to suspend it wasn't taken lightly.

Unfortunately, at this stage, even constantly re-submitting orders with tens of servers, the service still did not perform as we'd like.
Hopefully in the future submitting orders will be cheaper/faster/more efficient and we'll be able to resume this feature, but we can't commit on a date for the moment being.

As a reminder, LendingRobot never charged anything for selling LC notes.

I'll start this by saying I have always to this point been happy with Lending Robot and the service provided. That said I am like others that are 95% on the secondary market. The loss of secondary market functionality is A BIG DEAL.

While Lending Robot doesn't charge for selling notes, I am charged for 1% of my managed value, which includes notes I would sell via Lending Robot. Which I now have to sell MANUALLY. It's my position and others that we should not have to pay for something we now have to do ourselves.

Last night that process took an hour. I won't get into what my time is worth an hour but if this was my daily job it's about 3x what I pay for LR each month.

Please confirm that fixing and restoring secondary market operations is a high priority. I'm willing to wait a few weeks at most, but longer than that will force me to consider leaving Lending Robot.

Again I've been happy up to this point. I'd really like to continue with Lending Robot, but this is a deal breaker.

David

Fred93

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Re: Really annoying- Lending Robot suspending Folio buying/selling
« Reply #9 on: July 14, 2017, 07:15:50 PM »
Unfortunately, at this stage, even constantly re-submitting orders with tens of servers, the service still did not perform as we'd like.
Hopefully in the future submitting orders will be cheaper/faster/more efficient and we'll be able to resume this feature, but we can't commit

Would you tell more of the story?  Why were you resubmitting orders? ...

dr.everett

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Re: Really annoying- Lending Robot suspending Folio buying/selling
« Reply #10 on: July 14, 2017, 07:27:56 PM »
I'll hazard a guess and say that's how they handle processing orders with a declining markup. But we'll wait and see what the official answer is.

Rob L

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Re: Really annoying- Lending Robot suspending Folio buying/selling
« Reply #11 on: July 15, 2017, 11:18:02 AM »
The bottom line is likely, to be very kind, the "spartan" FolioFN API. Maybe its been enhanced since I used it a year ago, but back then there were only two end points; Buy and Sell. Everything else had to be done either by using the LC platform API or by direct URL access (GET/POST) to the LC or FolioFN platforms. This probably resulted in a very messy inefficient process that became untenable to LR when larger and larger numbers of FolioFn users came in. BTW, I think that to use URL access one must have full account credentials, not just API. Is this correct? If so then must Folio users of any 3rd party provide full account access credentials to them?

For example, obtaining the NEVERLATE status of a loan actually required re-submitting orders because it only exists in the secondarymarketall file. If a loan wasn't already in that file then the only solution I found (and implemented) was to list it at a extremely high markup, wait for it to show up in the file, obtain the NEVERLATE status, remove the highly priced sell order, calculate a real sales price based on NEVERLATE as well as other factors, and finally re-list. What a mess. Hugely inefficient and all because NEVERLATE is not in the mynotes file. In hindsight I would have been better off simply assuming NEVERLATE true. The result would be a few overpriced not NEVERLATE loans that would not sell and I could have dealt with manually.

AnilG

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Re: Really annoying- Lending Robot suspending Folio buying/selling
« Reply #12 on: July 15, 2017, 11:48:13 PM »
I don't believe issue is the "spartan" Folio API. It is the perverse incentive that a selling strategy based on automatically reducing price with time creates, the type of sellers it attracts, and the unintended consequences. I normally don't like to engage in discussions on other services forum section. Posts in these sections are for service owners to address and discuss. But I am happy to have more discussion in Foliofn-LC section if you start a thread about it.

BTW, the size of all notes listing file have been increasing rapidly recently. It is possible LC noticed the issue of excessive listings and reached out to Emannuel about it. I have no inside knowledge or insight into it, just a guess based on change in Folio listings file size before and after the suspension.

The bottom line is likely, to be very kind, the "spartan" FolioFN API. Maybe its been enhanced since I used it a year ago, but back then there were only two end points; Buy and Sell. Everything else had to be done either by using the LC platform API or by direct URL access (GET/POST) to the LC or FolioFN platforms. This probably resulted in a very messy inefficient process that became untenable to LR when larger and larger numbers of FolioFn users came in. BTW, I think that to use URL access one must have full account credentials, not just API. Is this correct? If so then must Folio users of any 3rd party provide full account access credentials to them?

For example, obtaining the NEVERLATE status of a loan actually required re-submitting orders because it only exists in the secondarymarketall file. If a loan wasn't already in that file then the only solution I found (and implemented) was to list it at a extremely high markup, wait for it to show up in the file, obtain the NEVERLATE status, remove the highly priced sell order, calculate a real sales price based on NEVERLATE as well as other factors, and finally re-list. What a mess. Hugely inefficient and all because NEVERLATE is not in the mynotes file. In hindsight I would have been better off simply assuming NEVERLATE true. The result would be a few overpriced not NEVERLATE loans that would not sell and I could have dealt with manually.
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dr.everett

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Re: Really annoying- Lending Robot suspending Folio buying/selling
« Reply #13 on: July 17, 2017, 11:01:30 PM »
I don't believe issue is the "spartan" Folio API. It is the perverse incentive that a selling strategy based on automatically reducing price with time creates, the type of sellers it attracts, and the unintended consequences. I normally don't like to engage in discussions on other services forum section. Posts in these sections are for service owners to address and discuss. But I am happy to have more discussion in Foliofn-LC section if you start a thread about it.

BTW, the size of all notes listing file have been increasing rapidly recently. It is possible LC noticed the issue of excessive listings and reached out to Emannuel about it. I have no inside knowledge or insight into it, just a guess based on change in Folio listings file size before and after the suspension.


I don't know what the issue is either but I'll speak to it from my side as someone who sold a lot. I was making good progress liquidating one of my accounts- sales have now dropped off by 50% of what they were before. I now have to spend about 2 hours a day that I didn't prior, managing my notes, between listing for sales, relisting for sales, purchasing the notes I want from the secondary market manually, etc. It's basically an hour per account. My time to me is worth more than what I'm currently paying. I will say that I saw some issues when the sales recurred, it took some time for those batches to process, but they eventually did. That's the only issue that I ever saw as an end user.

I came from Interest Radar because the selling features that Lending Robot had were much better then Interest Radar, and the automated buying features were better as well. Lending Robot was being actively developed whereas Interest Radar is dying on the vine. With the changes to Lending Robot, both secondary buying and selling advantages are now gone.

I was planning to let my Interest Radar subscription lapse when it comes due again in a few months- now that Lending Robot's functionality is uncertain I think I'll renew Interest Radar because it costs the same for a year as I pay for Lending Robot in a month. While the selling features are not optimal for the secondary market, they work. That means I get my 2 hours a day back.

Not that my payment matters to Lending Robot as I know I'm not a large account, but here's what I've decided. My next LR bill comes due on the 5th. If I haven't seen positive movement, or at least an indication of positive movement by then, I'll be closing my accounts.

Going to speak with my wallet.  I'm not paying for something that isn't providing value. :(

« Last Edit: July 17, 2017, 11:06:25 PM by dr.everett »

jdaun

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Re: Really annoying- Lending Robot suspending Folio buying/selling
« Reply #14 on: July 19, 2017, 11:44:13 AM »
I emailed LendingRobot asking them the following questions:
  • When do you estimate the Secondary Market buy/sell functionality will be available again?
  • What is the nature of the problem that led LendingRobot to halt secondary market trading?
  • Is LendingRobot actively working to bring it back, or is secondary market trading effectively gone for good?
Their (not helpful, not satisfying) reply:
Quote
Hello Jesse,
We will send out an announcement once we're able to share more information.
Regards,
Stephen