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Messages - dagilbe

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Investors - P / Re: American Pension Services in Receivership
« on: April 29, 2014, 05:19:39 AM »
My Prosper IRA account is now frozen.  This can't end well.  Do you think my funds will be OK since Prosper is the one that actually has possession of my IRA funds?

Investors - P / American Pension Services in Receivership
« on: April 29, 2014, 04:47:50 AM »
The worst news you can hear as an IRA investor.  I provided Equity Institutional all the paperwork to transfer my IRA back in February.  Here is to hoping the transfer was made. :-\

Dear American Pension Services Customer:


We write to you with an important update regarding American Pension Services ("APS") and your account at APS.


On April 24, 2014, the United States Securities and Exchange Commission ("SEC") filed a lawsuit against APS and its principal, Curtis DeYoung. The case is called Securities and Exchange Commission v. American Pension Services and Curtis L. DeYoung, Dist. Utah Case No. 2:14-cv-00309. The SEC alleges that APS has violated U.S. securities laws through the misappropriation of customer funds, the placement of unauthorized investments, forged direction letters, and inflated asset values.


At the request of the SEC, the U.S. District Court in Salt Lake placed APS in receivership. The Court has appointed a Receiver with the full power and authority over all APS operations. The Receiver reports directly to the Court.


To assist in that process, the Court has ordered frozen all APS accounts. As the Receiver, we have been charged with the responsibility of gathering and preserving all of the assets of American Pension Services, which includes any accounts and assets you have with American Pension Services. Our intent at this time is to safely secure all assets and accounts. As a result, we are freezing all accounts. This means that for a short period of time, you will not be able to change investments within your account or withdraw money from your account. We will make an effort to lift this restriction as soon as possible under the circumstances. We ask that you please be patient as we undertake this process.


The next Court hearing will likely be scheduled for early May. At that time, the Court will consider whether the receivership should become permanent. We should be able to provide more guidance after the hearing.


We know that you have many questions and we appreciate your patience at this time. We will keep you advised of any action required on your part and will keep you up to date as frequently as possible. We have set up a receivership website at, which will be our primary way of communicating with you. It contains a detailed set of answers to Frequently Asked Questions ("FAQs") and has the Court documents from the SEC's case. A copy of the FAQs also is attached. Again, we appreciate your patience and will post updates as the case progresses.


If you are not the contact person for your account or plan, please forward to us the name and information for the current contact person by email to


Very truly yours,

Diane Thompson

Receiver, American Pension Services
Frequently Asked Questions
Question:        Is APS still in business?

Answer:           Yes. But its operations are controlled by the Court through the Receiver, at least until the next scheduled court hearing. As a result, temporary limitations on APS and its operations have been put in place to protect account holders.


Question:         Is any money missing from APS accounts?

Answer:           Maybe. The SEC's papers filed with the Court indicate that the SEC has reason to conclude that over $20 million is missing out of $300 million under management. You can read more about this in the SEC's pleadings, which are posted to the receivership website. The defendants in the litigation have a right to contest the SEC's conclusions. Ultimately, the Court will determine what money, if any, is missing.


Question:         Could any new funds be lost?

Answer:           No, so long as they were located in APS bank accounts that have been frozen by the Court's Order. As part of the Court's appointment of a Receiver, such accounts are now protected against improper withdrawals. 


Question:         Can I make a new withdrawal from my account prior to the next Court hearing?

Answer:           No. The Court has determined that no new withdrawals can occur, at least until the next hearing. This is to protect the interests of all account holders.


Question:         I don't want to make a new withdrawal, but I am owed a scheduled automatic distribution. Will this still occur?

Answer:           Probably not. We will be assessing any scheduled automatic distributions. We can only authorize those if permitted by Court Order. We realize they are an important matter for many account-holders. They will be addressed as soon as possible, consistent the terms of the Court's Orders in this matter.


Question:         I want to sell an asset in my account (such as stock, gold, or property).   Can I do that prior to the next Court hearing?

Answer:           No. No sales of assets can occur at this time.


Question:         I want to purchase an asset with the money in my account (such as stock, gold, or property).   Can I do that prior to the next Court hearing?

Answer:           No. No new purchases can occur until the next Court hearing absent extraordinary circumstances.


Question:         Why is the APS website not working?

Answer:           The website may be unavailable at times over the course of the next week due to the ongoing investigation. We apologize for the inconvenience this will cause. We will strive to have the website operational as soon as possible


Question:         Why cannot I get through on the phones and/or get a response to my email?

Answer:           We are working hard to get the Court the information it needs. That is the first step in protecting APS account holders. Because this is our first task, we are unable at this time to respond to all of the inquiries we receive. Please be patient. We will be able to respond to inquiries more efficiently once we have completed the initial steps we need to take to protect account holders.


Investors - P / Prosper Returns
« on: February 02, 2014, 10:45:18 AM »
As of Feb. 1st, my Prosper returns plummeted from 13% seasoned and 14% unseasoned to 8% seasoned and 9% unseasoned.   :o

I have had my account for over two years and have over 800 notes in my account. My account has always hovered between the 12-16% return rate. 

Did Prosper change their investment return calculation or have I just been hit with a lot of defaults this past month?  Has anyone else experienced this?  Maybe I have, due to a limited selection, got into notes that I had no business getting into?

Investors - P / Re: Gone in 60 seconds!
« on: December 18, 2013, 08:31:07 PM »
Seattle, thank you for posting.  This chart represents everything that is wrong with P2P lending.  If you wonder why the loan quality has been so bad over the past year, this is why. 

What services are out there that use the API to automatically invest?  I am sick of the leftovers.

Investors - P / Re: APS and Prosper Fighting
« on: August 30, 2013, 12:00:53 AM »
I got the same email and a phone call from Prosper.  On paper it sounds like Prosper is handling this well. 

It sounds like Prosper wanted to renegotiate APS rates but APS refused.  Poorly played on APS's part. 

Investors - P / Re: APS and Prosper Fighting
« on: August 29, 2013, 09:25:42 AM »
I also got a letter from APS and immediately voiced my concerns to Prosper.  I received an email from Prosper who advised me to ignore the APS letter.  I got the impression that Prosper was going to work things out with APS. 

It sounded like Prosper's new management was attempting to reneg on the original agreement to pay APS for its services and Prosper reconsidered its position after receiving backlash from Prosper lenders. 

The APS letter was a joke.  In the APS letter you could either initial the letter and agree to be bound by APS' payment schedule  or you could do nothing and be bound to APS' payment schedule anyway.  I think the whole purpose of the letter was to put more pressure on Prosper to make good on their purported agreement.

Investors - P / Auto Investing/ NSRP/ and beating the Institutions
« on: July 17, 2013, 07:56:35 AM »
I am not finding the quality of notes that I used to.  It sounds like I am not the only person to experience this problem. 

From your experience, how helpful is auto investing through Prosper?

I'm considering using NSRP but I'm hesitant to shell out $25/ month.  Is this service worth it?  How is it different than auto invest through Prosper?  Are there any other API investing platforms that people recommend?

Great news for retail investors.  Now only if they even the playing field by eliminating the whole loan program.   ;D

Investors - P / Re: Whole Loan Program - Fair or Not?
« on: June 02, 2013, 09:20:35 AM »
Do you honestly believe that institutional investors only invest in the whole program and not the fractional program?  Serious institutional investors are cherry picking notes from the whole program and investing big chunks  within minutes of the release of new notes in the fractional share program. 

While some retail investors may outperform the institutional investors on a given year, there are thousands of retail investors and only a limited number of institutional investors. 

The fact of the matter is that these institutions have access to more notes than retail investors and therefore have a leg up on the average Joe. 

One can argue that Prosper incorporated the whole program to increase profitability; however, institutional investors such as worth blanket have regularly invested in fractional notes and I would be surprised if significant new institutional funds came to Prosper just because of the whole note program.  Additionally, even if institutional investors invested more money in Prosper, I would guess that the whole notes invested in by the institutions would otherwise be fully funded by retail investors as a part of the fractional program.  While Prosper has started to cater to the institutional investors, Prosper faces a real risk of disenfranchising its retail investors. 

The recent poor selection of notes available to retail investors on Prosper IMO is due partially to the implementation of the whole note program. 

These past few months have been the worst collection of new notes that I have seen.  I want to put another 5.5K in my Prosper Roth but the selection has been so bad that I am afraid it would take me 6 months to invest the funds in $25 increments.  Hopefully things turn around but the poor selection is getting ridiculous. 

Investors - LC / Re: How much of your portfolio goes to P2P lending?
« on: April 06, 2013, 09:40:11 AM »
I have the following investments:

Prosper                 12%
Prosper Roth IRA     6%
LC                            .5%
Brokerage Accts      50%
Roth IRA                  26%
Cash/Other             5.5%

The run up in the stock market has been good to me.  Like others have stated, I feel more comfortable in investing in P2P lending right now rather than throwing money in the stock market that is now at a record high.  I do not have a single late note at LC (I only have 10 notes at LC).  Maybe I will invest more at LC in the future?   For whatever reason, I much prefer Prosper's platform over LC's and my returns at Prosper have been stellar. 

As far as yield, I really like PFF because of its 6 percent annual yield paid on a monthly basis.  I also like TBT and/or TMV because interest rates cannot remain low forever. 

Why do some people consider P2P to be illiquid?  I have no trouble trading notes on Folio, especially if the notes are priced right.  However, I wish I could trade late notes on Prosper. 

I'm relatively young (28), and I just started a law practice at the beginning of this year.  Whatever funds I do not put back into my practice, I intend to invest 50% in P2P, 30% in the stock market, and 20% in savings.  Maybe I will buy real estate in the near future?

Investors - P / New Prosper Layout
« on: April 03, 2013, 06:17:23 AM »
I hate it.  Everything is darker and the font is difficult to read.  It sounds like more amateur hour from Prosper's new leadership. 

Investors - P / Re: No more info on loan investors and bids
« on: March 07, 2013, 08:58:23 AM »
I agree, it is a BIG MISTAKE for Prosper to eliminate the users names and the bid amounts.  Nobody knows who the individual users are anyway. 

For a company that has been really struggling to fill loans lately, I can't believe Prosper's road to recovery includes eliminating information to investors.  It's a slippery slope, and the migration of assets to LC has already commenced. 

Investors - P / Re: Is this real?
« on: February 08, 2013, 11:23:59 AM »
He (or she) probably had a business and declared bankruptcy hence the large number of public records.  After all, he is in the construction business and probably has various material suppliers, sub-contractors, etc. that he worked with. 

Caveat emptor is the name of the game. 

Investors - P / Re: Worth-Blanket2 is back...
« on: February 07, 2013, 09:54:27 AM »
Good to have him back.  The only problem is I need to be on Prosper at 11 a.m. and 7 p.m. CST in order to scoop up the good loans before he does. 

Peter, were you going to post more information on the drop in repeat borrow returns?

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