Author Topic: Anyone else using automated trading on foliofn?  (Read 9043 times)

toben88

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Anyone else using automated trading on foliofn?
« on: February 14, 2017, 12:20:33 PM »
Hello,

I am looking for others who are also automating their trading on foliofn.  I am currently doing about 160 automated trades a month but I want to increase this if I can do some historical modeling.

Anyone know of modeling tools or samples? Now that Nickel Steamroller is not as robust I may need to create my own from scratch.

Are there any tools to autotrade that are better than lending robot? I need to be able to trade based off loan purpose and income and this is not currently an option with lending robot.

Thanks in advance!

fliphusker

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Re: Anyone else using automated trading on foliofn?
« Reply #1 on: February 14, 2017, 01:39:13 PM »
Assuming you are talking about automatic buying?
If so, no because of the issues associated with notes that I am sure all sites and their automated tools do not see in notes. 
Downturns in FICO scores even if they are still up.
Notes that have a recent IGP but listed as never late.
A recent change in borrows payment date.  If it is outside of around 5 months does not bother me, but do not buy notes inside of that time frame. 

Might want to check out PeerCube and Anil for more info there. 
I use NSR but I hand pick notes as I am a small fish, about half of what you do.

Rob L

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Re: Anyone else using automated trading on foliofn?
« Reply #2 on: February 14, 2017, 02:40:39 PM »
Haven't heard from Fred (not Fred93) in a long while. Maybe he will respond; hope he does.
He is (was) into this in a very big way quantitatively (Markov chains and all).
« Last Edit: February 14, 2017, 02:46:01 PM by Rob L »

AnilG

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Re: Anyone else using automated trading on foliofn?
« Reply #3 on: February 14, 2017, 04:18:31 PM »
Have you looked into PeerCube for secondary platform automation? Following blog posts will give you pretty good idea about what we can do.

Six Steps to Automated Selling on Lending Club Folio Secondary Market https://www.peercube.com/blog/post/six-steps-to-automated-selling-on-lending-club-folio-secondary-market

Enhancements to Automated Note Selling on Lending Club Folio Secondary Market https://www.peercube.com/blog/post/enhancements-to-automated-note-selling-on-lending-club-folio-secondary-market

Automated Buying of Notes on Lending Club Folio Secondary Market https://www.peercube.com/blog/post/automated-buying-of-notes-on-lending-club-folio-secondary-market

How to automate Note Selling on Lending Club Secondary Market with PeerCube? https://www.peercube.com/blog/post/how-to-automate-note-selling-on-lending-club-secondary-market-with-peercube
---
Anil Gupta
PeerCube Thoughts blog https://www.peercube.com/blog
PeerCube https://www.peercube.com

GregTexas

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Re: Anyone else using automated trading on foliofn?
« Reply #4 on: March 29, 2017, 03:11:06 PM »

Notes that have a recent IGP but listed as never late.


This scared me until I checked that I filter for notes that have a status of "current"  and have never been late. I ignore notes with a status of "In Grace Period".

fliphusker

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Re: Anyone else using automated trading on foliofn?
« Reply #5 on: March 29, 2017, 04:17:10 PM »

Notes that have a recent IGP but listed as never late.


This scared me until I checked that I filter for notes that have a status of "current"  and have never been late. I ignore notes with a status of "In Grace Period".
In the eyes of LC, notes that are in IGP are not late.
This is from Leena from LC who I have been swapping emails with. Unfortunately half my questions have been waiting for responses while she checks with others.
Quote
When looking at your example of the never late note, I noticed that the only late statuses where payments were made was the grace period. The grace period will not register as late until it slips past 16 days. Does that answer your question about that? Or are you seeing others that are in the late status over 16 days?
This note actually showed up as never late, not sure if it still listed as never late or not.
https://www.lendingclub.com/foliofn/browseNotesLoanPerf.action?showfoliofn=true&loan_id=11726141&order_id=17213055&note_id=40147520
This one is listed as never late, but clearly been in IGP.
https://www.lendingclub.com/foliofn/browseNotesLoanPerf.action?showfoliofn=true&loan_id=7645598&order_id=12014502&note_id=31457707

Fred93

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Re: Anyone else using automated trading on foliofn?
« Reply #6 on: March 29, 2017, 07:34:26 PM »
IGP is a strange "state" for a loan.  It doesn't persist long, so isn't captured in the payments file (which contains monthly entries).  There's no way to query via the API whether a loan has ever been IGP.  Etc.  In short, it behaves differently than the other loan states.

GregTexas

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Re: Anyone else using automated trading on foliofn?
« Reply #7 on: March 29, 2017, 08:56:17 PM »
Personally I would not consider a note being paid during the grace period as being paid late.

Fred93

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Re: Anyone else using automated trading on foliofn?
« Reply #8 on: March 29, 2017, 09:25:47 PM »
Personally I would not consider a note being paid during the grace period as being paid late.

Sure.  In fact, the very reason it's called a "grace" period is that historically this meant a period of time before penalties were enforced.

Historically, we used to MAIL in checks to pay loans.  When I had a mortgage I often paid a few days late, ie in the "grace" period, simply because I wasn't attentive.

However, for almost all LC loans, the payments are withdrawn automatically from the borrower's checking account.  Therefore IGP doesn't mean that the borrower forgot.  It means that there isn't enough money there to make the payment.  This could occur for several different reasons, including...
  • The borrower's running short this month.
  • The borrower closed the account for innocent reasons, and hasn't given LC a new one, but will once they remind him.
  • Borrower has told his bank to stop allowing these automated withdrawals.  Maybe identity theft.  Maybe borrower just saying screw you.
  • The borrower has taken his money and vanished.
  • A technical problem, bank screwup.  Borrower will fix.

Many possibilities are bad news.  Even the first one, possibly innocent, gives us some information about the individual's cash management which is sometimes a sign of financial stress.

It would be great to quantify the information provided by IGP, but the fact that IGPs are not recorded in LC's historical payments file makes that essentially impossible.


fliphusker

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Re: Anyone else using automated trading on foliofn?
« Reply #9 on: March 30, 2017, 03:45:30 AM »
Personally I would not consider a note being paid during the grace period as being paid late.

Maybe there was a fire at the bank.
The bank blew away in a tornado.
The dog ate his paycheck and he could not get it into the bank on time.
The IRS froze the wrong checking account.

Late is late when buying on FOLIO. Dr. Everett and jz are the heavy FOLIO buyers here and I would guess they would say the same thing.
I am not going to touch a note with 18 payments made with no issues, but on the 19th (same month it is up for sale) it is IGP, at a 1% discount and 20% YTM with an up FICO. Will I touch that note like that if they went IGP in the 2nd month? A decent chance.
Does a note worry you that all of a sudden it went from 15 to 16 days late? It is only one day, right?

GregTexas

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Re: Anyone else using automated trading on foliofn?
« Reply #10 on: March 30, 2017, 09:13:31 AM »
Yes the IGP reasons are endless including some set up auto-pay to pay every month during the grace period.
I'd rather not eliminate notes based on this factor and continue to rely on "never late".

dr.everett

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Re: Anyone else using automated trading on foliofn?
« Reply #11 on: March 30, 2017, 05:50:50 PM »
Personally I would not consider a note being paid during the grace period as being paid late.
Late is late when buying on FOLIO. Dr. Everett and jz are the heavy FOLIO buyers here and I would guess they would say the same thing.

I would agree- if I could find a way to get IGP and have my automation sell on it I would jump all over it. Never Late is good and boring. IGP is a harbinger of bad things to come. All of my Late/CO notes showed some or multiple IGP before finally walking the plank. Much like I wish I had better options to sell on FICO drops on Lending Robot, I would dance a jig for IGP sales.

thezfunk

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Re: Anyone else using automated trading on foliofn?
« Reply #12 on: March 31, 2017, 02:42:23 PM »
Personally I would not consider a note being paid during the grace period as being paid late.
Late is late when buying on FOLIO. Dr. Everett and jz are the heavy FOLIO buyers here and I would guess they would say the same thing.

I would agree- if I could find a way to get IGP and have my automation sell on it I would jump all over it. Never Late is good and boring. IGP is a harbinger of bad things to come. All of my Late/CO notes showed some or multiple IGP before finally walking the plank. Much like I wish I had better options to sell on FICO drops on Lending Robot, I would dance a jig for IGP sales.

I really wish we had more granularity on Lending Robot to sell FICO down notes too.  I only want to see Down notes that meet other criteria but, alas, that is not possible.  I have talked to them about it.

fliphusker

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Re: Anyone else using automated trading on foliofn?
« Reply #13 on: March 31, 2017, 06:16:35 PM »
Personally I would not consider a note being paid during the grace period as being paid late.
Late is late when buying on FOLIO. Dr. Everett and jz are the heavy FOLIO buyers here and I would guess they would say the same thing.

I would agree- if I could find a way to get IGP and have my automation sell on it I would jump all over it. Never Late is good and boring. IGP is a harbinger of bad things to come. All of my Late/CO notes showed some or multiple IGP before finally walking the plank. Much like I wish I had better options to sell on FICO drops on Lending Robot, I would dance a jig for IGP sales.

I really wish we had more granularity on Lending Robot to sell FICO down notes too.  I only want to see Down notes that meet other criteria but, alas, that is not possible.  I have talked to them about it.
Have you looked at Peercube? When Anil gave me a month free use of their premium I do not remember what was all listed there on selling of notes.

Lovinglifestyle

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Re: Anyone else using automated trading on foliofn?
« Reply #14 on: March 31, 2017, 07:51:05 PM »
PeerCube has selling choices for Loan Status, Loan Purpose, Credit Grade, Credit Score Trend, Application Type, Loan Length, and Never Late.
Interest Rate, Outstanding Note Principal, and Markup/Discount Range are also available.
Hope that's pertinent info.